Comments on: Why I quit the Baha’i Faith. http://circleh.wordpress.com/2007/10/19/why-i-quit-the-baha%e2%80%99i-faith/ Human virtues, stupidity, and science. Fri, 04 Jul 2008 07:18:53 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=MU By: hobojoe3000 http://circleh.wordpress.com/2007/10/19/why-i-quit-the-baha%e2%80%99i-faith/#comment-156 hobojoe3000 Sat, 12 Jan 2008 01:06:54 +0000 http://circleh.wordpress.com/2007/10/19/why-i-quit-the-baha%e2%80%99i-faith/#comment-156 Also, I find it strange that you say Baha'is fail to live up to their own moral standards. From my own experience, while they aren't prefect, they are generally stringent about the laws. I find it rare to find a lifelong Baha'i who has had premarital sex or drunk alcohol. Keep in mind this is just from my experience in my own community and the community you were a part of may be entirely different than my own. Of course, my community is small, and as (if) it grows, just by statistics, the amount of people who behave contrary to the laws will grow, but this is true of any institution, so I view it as a moot point. Again: happy skepticism. Good blog, by the way. I especially like the pieces about silly Intelligent Designers. Oh Intelligent Design, you so crazy. Also, I find it strange that you say Baha’is fail to live up to their own moral standards. From my own experience, while they aren’t prefect, they are generally stringent about the laws. I find it rare to find a lifelong Baha’i who has had premarital sex or drunk alcohol. Keep in mind this is just from my experience in my own community and the community you were a part of may be entirely different than my own. Of course, my community is small, and as (if) it grows, just by statistics, the amount of people who behave contrary to the laws will grow, but this is true of any institution, so I view it as a moot point.

Again: happy skepticism. Good blog, by the way. I especially like the pieces about silly Intelligent Designers. Oh Intelligent Design, you so crazy.

]]> By: hobojoe3000 http://circleh.wordpress.com/2007/10/19/why-i-quit-the-baha%e2%80%99i-faith/#comment-155 hobojoe3000 Sat, 12 Jan 2008 00:57:52 +0000 http://circleh.wordpress.com/2007/10/19/why-i-quit-the-baha%e2%80%99i-faith/#comment-155 I suppose that I view the declaration of infallibility as a more pragmatic provision than a metaphysical statement which is declared for largely the same reason that the supreme court is given the power it has (otherwise there is a system of infinite appeals). Perhaps to some as yourself such a statement has too much metaphysical component to be viewed as truth, but to me, it is not so. Ultimately though, I think what you are saying will happen cannot happen because supposing that the Baha'i institution becomes corrupt, it is still an elected institution which eventually gets reelected, thereby (hopefully, although this requires effort on part of the individual Baha'is) eliminating the corruption; and even if the institution becomes so corrupt as to be irreparable, provisions in the Baha'i faith itself allow people to leave unconditionally of their own volition and in no wise to be belittled, put down, or viewed as "condemned" as is common in other religious followings. If, even then, the institution became so corrupt that it pursues former believers and attempts to force its doctrines on the unwilling (a thing expressly forbidden by the faith and one of the things I view as setting it apart from other religious institutions) then even such devout believers as myself would leave the faith and pursue their religious lives in another manner. Keep in mind as well that people outside the faith are under no jurisdiction of the faith. Which is why Wikipedia currently has an image of Baha'u'llah on it's article on the Baha'i faith: as a non-Baha'i institution, the Baha'i institution has no control over what it does. Just some thoughts. Wishing you happy skepticism. I suppose that I view the declaration of infallibility as a more pragmatic provision than a metaphysical statement which is declared for largely the same reason that the supreme court is given the power it has (otherwise there is a system of infinite appeals). Perhaps to some as yourself such a statement has too much metaphysical component to be viewed as truth, but to me, it is not so. Ultimately though, I think what you are saying will happen cannot happen because supposing that the Baha’i institution becomes corrupt, it is still an elected institution which eventually gets reelected, thereby (hopefully, although this requires effort on part of the individual Baha’is) eliminating the corruption; and even if the institution becomes so corrupt as to be irreparable, provisions in the Baha’i faith itself allow people to leave unconditionally of their own volition and in no wise to be belittled, put down, or viewed as “condemned” as is common in other religious followings. If, even then, the institution became so corrupt that it pursues former believers and attempts to force its doctrines on the unwilling (a thing expressly forbidden by the faith and one of the things I view as setting it apart from other religious institutions) then even such devout believers as myself would leave the faith and pursue their religious lives in another manner.

Keep in mind as well that people outside the faith are under no jurisdiction of the faith. Which is why Wikipedia currently has an image of Baha’u'llah on it’s article on the Baha’i faith: as a non-Baha’i institution, the Baha’i institution has no control over what it does.

Just some thoughts. Wishing you happy skepticism.

]]> By: anwarica http://circleh.wordpress.com/2007/10/19/why-i-quit-the-baha%e2%80%99i-faith/#comment-116 anwarica Sun, 02 Dec 2007 10:39:33 +0000 http://circleh.wordpress.com/2007/10/19/why-i-quit-the-baha%e2%80%99i-faith/#comment-116 Hello, Let me congratulate you for being atheist .. actually that's not my speech, but you can watch this video to know why Muslims congratulate you :) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vyboXCIVJY0 you can skip the first part of the video and continue with the atheism issue .. wishing you a good luck in your life. Hello,
Let me congratulate you for being atheist .. actually that’s not my speech, but you can watch this video to know why Muslims congratulate you :)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vyboXCIVJY0
you can skip the first part of the video and continue with the atheism issue .. wishing you a good luck in your life.

]]> By: Stefan http://circleh.wordpress.com/2007/10/19/why-i-quit-the-baha%e2%80%99i-faith/#comment-73 Stefan Sat, 20 Oct 2007 23:52:18 +0000 http://circleh.wordpress.com/2007/10/19/why-i-quit-the-baha%e2%80%99i-faith/#comment-73 "I encourage others to investigate the Baha’i Faith for themselves so they will know I told the truth. My word alone is not sufficient." believe me "God Alone" is not Islam you already know, investigate and see for yourself “I encourage others to investigate the Baha’i Faith for themselves so they will know I told the truth. My word alone is not sufficient.”

believe me “God Alone” is not Islam you already know, investigate and see for yourself

]]> By: Dale Husband http://circleh.wordpress.com/2007/10/19/why-i-quit-the-baha%e2%80%99i-faith/#comment-72 Dale Husband Sat, 20 Oct 2007 23:07:30 +0000 http://circleh.wordpress.com/2007/10/19/why-i-quit-the-baha%e2%80%99i-faith/#comment-72 Uh, that is a forum run by Muslims, Stefan. Sorry, but if I don't accept Islam at all, as my blog above makes clear, your offer is pointless. I'd rather go to these places: http://atheism.about.com/ http://www.atheists-online.com/links.asp?p=7 http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/ http://www.iheu.org/ http://www.americanhumanist.org/index.html Uh, that is a forum run by Muslims, Stefan.

Sorry, but if I don’t accept Islam at all, as my blog above makes clear, your offer is pointless.

I’d rather go to these places:
http://atheism.about.com/
http://www.atheists-online.com/links.asp?p=7
http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/
http://www.iheu.org/
http://www.americanhumanist.org/index.html

]]> By: Stefan http://circleh.wordpress.com/2007/10/19/why-i-quit-the-baha%e2%80%99i-faith/#comment-71 Stefan Sat, 20 Oct 2007 21:57:23 +0000 http://circleh.wordpress.com/2007/10/19/why-i-quit-the-baha%e2%80%99i-faith/#comment-71 try "God Alone" http://free-minds.org/forum/ peace try “God Alone”

http://free-minds.org/forum/

peace

]]> By: Dale Husband http://circleh.wordpress.com/2007/10/19/why-i-quit-the-baha%e2%80%99i-faith/#comment-70 Dale Husband Sat, 20 Oct 2007 07:37:58 +0000 http://circleh.wordpress.com/2007/10/19/why-i-quit-the-baha%e2%80%99i-faith/#comment-70 Thank you, Neshia. Well, at least you didn't claim that I misrepresented your Faith in some way. Everything I said in that blog I know to be true, and I encourage others to investigate the Baha'i Faith for themselves so they will know I told the truth. My word alone is not sufficient. What really irked me about the Baha'i Faith, even as a dedicated member, was how poorly the Baha'is themselves lived up to its high moral standards. The teachings of Baha'i sexual morals are exactly the same as those of traditional Judaism, Christianity, and Islam (sex only within marriage, rejection of homosexuality). Even I failed to follow that strict standard, and eventually concluded that it was irrational to even try because it went against human nature. And anything that goes against human nature is a threat to human welfare. Thank you, Neshia.
Well, at least you didn’t claim that I misrepresented your Faith in some way. Everything I said in that blog I know to be true, and I encourage others to investigate the Baha’i Faith for themselves so they will know I told the truth. My word alone is not sufficient.

What really irked me about the Baha’i Faith, even as a dedicated member, was how poorly the Baha’is themselves lived up to its high moral standards. The teachings of Baha’i sexual morals are exactly the same as those of traditional Judaism, Christianity, and Islam (sex only within marriage, rejection of homosexuality). Even I failed to follow that strict standard, and eventually concluded that it was irrational to even try because it went against human nature. And anything that goes against human nature is a threat to human welfare.

]]> By: Neshia http://circleh.wordpress.com/2007/10/19/why-i-quit-the-baha%e2%80%99i-faith/#comment-69 Neshia Sat, 20 Oct 2007 06:52:15 +0000 http://circleh.wordpress.com/2007/10/19/why-i-quit-the-baha%e2%80%99i-faith/#comment-69 Mr. Husband, I respect your opinions about the Baha'i' Faith. I see your point about how utterly ridiculous it is for one to claim infallibility. Were I not raised in the Baha'i' Faith, I would probably have trouble accepting that as well. The underlying tone that I can read into your publication is that you had great hope and your hopes were dashed. I am deeply sorry for that. I wish I had been with your during your days within the Baha'i' Faith. I would have availed myself to you for questions and advice on which books to read and which classes to take. But, alas, I was not. At this point, I can offer you this one advice. With the utmost sincerity, ask God to guide you to His Word. See what happens. I'm not saying that you'll end up back with the Baha'i's. You might not. But, if you are sincere, what will happen is that God will put you on the path of His choice. And like they said in the Old Days; "All roads lead to Rome." If you want to correspond via email about these matters, I am happy to do that with you. I also have a Yahoo chat ID. Neshia Mr. Husband,
I respect your opinions about the Baha’i’ Faith. I see your point about how utterly ridiculous it is for one to claim infallibility. Were I not raised in the Baha’i’ Faith, I would probably have trouble accepting that as well.

The underlying tone that I can read into your publication is that you had great hope and your hopes were dashed. I am deeply sorry for that. I wish I had been with your during your days within the Baha’i’ Faith. I would have availed myself to you for questions and advice on which books to read and which classes to take. But, alas, I was not.

At this point, I can offer you this one advice. With the utmost sincerity, ask God to guide you to His Word. See what happens. I’m not saying that you’ll end up back with the Baha’i’s. You might not. But, if you are sincere, what will happen is that God will put you on the path of His choice. And like they said in the Old Days; “All roads lead to Rome.”

If you want to correspond via email about these matters, I am happy to do that with you. I also have a Yahoo chat ID.
Neshia

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